Unleash Your Hidden Power & Boost Your Confidence with Bryan Ruby

[00:00:00] Bryan: For me, it was about wanting to live my life authentically and just sick and tired of hiding. I hid for so long, and at the end of the day, I felt like I didn't have a hero when I was a kid in baseball. I would drive to the ball field, listening to country radio, windows down, sound of freedom pulsing through my veins and think, well, where are the people like me?

[00:00:42] Kate: Hey, there. Welcome back to Rawish with Kate Eckman. We have such a fun episode for you today, and it's going to be really compelling, and it really is the heart and soul of why I created this show, to really do authentic storytelling, to embrace our humanity. I love to have on guests who are very courageous and are going against the grain and really are daring and bold enough to be who they truly are. Not that polished, put together person we often present to the world, but that person behind the scenes who has some realness to share, who is perhaps disrupting the status quo a bit, which I can relate to.

[00:01:24] I'm just so thrilled to introduce you to someone who's really going to give you the inspiration to embrace who you truly are and to come out as that person regardless of how we think others will perceive us, or maybe the fear of how others will perceive us, maybe the fear of being seen, or not good enough, or going against what mom and dad may like, or certainly what society says we should be doing.

[00:01:50] Let's throw all of that out and just really embrace and honor who we truly are. So someone who's going to help us do that, someone with the best hair I may have ever seen in my life, let me introduce you to Bryan Ruby. Thank you so much for being here.

[00:02:07] Bryan: Thank you. Thanks. Having me on. How's it going?

[00:02:10] Kate: It is going so well. And for those people who don't know, you were the first active professional baseball player to come out as gay, which is so extraordinary. Thank you so much for doing that. And also someone who is not only athletically talented, but also is a rising star in country music and writing songs, embracing who you are, not pretending to be someone you're not to sell more records.

[00:02:34] And I think therefore, because you are being who you truly are, you will naturally sell more records. So that's exciting. But I'm just so curious. In a world, especially in professional sports, that's so masculine and can even have that toxic masculinity and really press you guys down in terms of, embracing your feelings and things like that, what allowed you to just come out as gay while you were still playing without the fear of even being persecuted by some for your identity?

[00:03:06] Bryan: Yeah. Honestly, I don't think I was the first ever. There was a couple guys, Glenn Burke comes to mind, Billy Bean, guys who came out after they retired. I always liked to point those guys out because they came out decades before I came out. I only came out publicly in 2021. But at the end of the day, for me, it was about wanting to live my life authentically and just sick and tired of hiding.

[00:03:31] I hid for so long, and at the end of the day, I felt like I didn't have a hero when I was a kid in baseball. I would drive to the ball field, listening to country radio, windows down, sound of freedom pulsing through my veins and think, well, where are the people like me?

[00:03:53] So in both of those areas, and those are just the things that I grew up with and the areas that I was interested in and passionate about. So first it was baseball. Now it's music. They've always gone hand in hand because whenever you're on the baseball field, especially me growing up, playing different lots of tournaments, and going South, going to Georgia, and going to Florida and Virginia, there was always country music on. So those cultures are very intertwined. I always like to say that. But at the end of the day, I wanted to live my life and was sick and tired of hiding.

[00:04:32] Kate: Yeah. I'm writing down, "Where are the people like me?" And when that comes to mind, I don't think of, in my case-- I'll go watch Barbie, but what I loved about Barbie in 2023 was the Barbies were all shapes and sizes, racist, ethnicities. But when I think of people like me, I think more people who are doing life on their own terms, who have the courage to be who they are, regardless of what people may say about them. Some people think it's weird I'm not married with children, for instance, at my age or at any age.

[00:05:04] Bryan: Yeah. I feel like we get pressured to follow a certain path, whether that's the star athlete path, get the hot girlfriend, settle down. There's things that are expected of you. And I'm not saying, "Oh, it's so tough to be a star athlete." No.

[00:05:21] It's just that whatever environment we grow up in, we get pushed down certain paths, and it's very, very hard, and it ruffles feathers to stand out from that and to chase who you are and what you want to do. And I've felt forever that I've had to go against the grain, and I just haven't fit into the boxes, whatever you're supposed to be, that our culture tells us. You know what I mean?

[00:05:46] Kate: Yeah. And there's so much name calling even with gay men. The F word just came to mind. And even I have friends in 2024 that say they'll be on vacation and there's men screaming at them, hey, you bunch of, F words. And so was there fear to come out and be part of a community that is-- I forget because I've spent most of my life in New York and LA, work and fashion.

[00:06:13] I'm surrounded by people in the LGBTQ community. Some of my closest dearest friends are gay, bisexual, lesbian. My gay friend had to explain to me how homophobic the world still is. Was there fear for you to be openly present in that community because of that?

[00:06:30] Bryan: Yeah, I would say homophobic in many pockets. You just got to find a place where there are people like you. But if you're in somewhere like where I was in baseball, that's a very tough environment to be different in. Baseball is very homogenous, very straight, white culture, not a ton of diversity. So I would hear things on the ball field like f you faggot every day. It was just a regular part of the ballpark.

[00:07:07] Kate: Culture. Yeah.

[00:07:08] Bryan: The culture. Yeah. And sometimes maybe it wasn't directed at me, but it was just always thrown around as the insult. We were taught the worst possible thing to be is gay in baseball. You got to be a macho man. And at the end of the day, whether or not you have the skill to connect the bat with the ball that's coming at you at 95 miles an hour has no correlation to who you date. It's completely different things, obviously.

[00:07:36] I feel like most people understand that. But that was pretty regular, and I guess what I've tried to do with everything that I've done, whether it's in baseball or music, it's just show that like, "Hey, we can be here. I'm inviting you in to know this part of me. It's just one part of me."

[00:07:54] Just like anything else, what I ate for dinner yesterday, what kind of music I listen to, or what I'm doing this weekend where we're going out and hanging out, it's just one part of me. But all I've tried to do is just show that you can be a positive, contributing member of any arena that you want to be in.

[00:08:14] If you work hard, you show up every day, give it your all, and if you put the work in, it'll pay off. The proudest thing that I did in baseball besides setting up our charity, which I can talk about, is the fact that I was able to stay on my team after coming out. That's it.

[00:08:33] That may sound very basic. And I actually had the best year that I had in my career the year I came out. Because I felt more free and was able to play without weight on my shoulders. But just the fact that I was able to stay on the team and show that somebody like me could play and play well, even though it wasn't in the major leagues. It was at a much lower level, just barely scratching the surface of professional baseball.

[00:09:00] But just show that we can play. And it's the same thing in country music. I'm playing bars. I'm playing the honky tonk. I'm not playing football stadiums like Taylor Swift right now. It's bars, and I'm opening for people, and I'm starting to get on the path. And really, all I want to do is just show that we can play too. People like me deserve a spot in country music if you put the work in, if you write the songs, if you show up every day. That's the name of the game.

[00:09:28] Kate: Yeah. Walk us through that decision making process of deciding it's finally time to come out while you're still an active baseball player and you still have these teammates who are saying some of the things that they're saying and the culture that we live in.

[00:09:43] Because I know there's at least one person listening who whether they want to come out as gay, or maybe they need to come out to their partner as unhappy and, "I need to end this relationship," or, "You know what, this isn't working for me anymore at this job," whatever relationship or whatever identity that we're ready to release and let go of. Can you talk to us a little bit about how you were able to do that and how you can encourage others to do the same?

[00:10:10] Bryan: Yeah, for me, I was in a relationship at the time. We can come back to that a little bit later because that's on topic with the music right now. But I was in a relationship and, again, I was just like, I would do things like go over to my partner's family's house for Christmas, and we took a great picture under the Christmas tree, and I opened up my phone on Instagram to post it just like anybody else.

[00:10:38] Picture with your partner and his parents under the Christmas tree. Pretty basic, pretty standard. Nothing scandalous or anything. And I had this gut feeling that I shouldn't do it, and this pit in my stomach like, "Oh my God, if I ever post a picture, something as simple as a picture under the Christmas tree, I may never get my job back ever again in baseball. I may never play again." That was the fear. Just because of one thing like that, if anybody knows.

[00:11:10] And finally, what I did was I decided, okay, if I get signed again for that season and I feel like I'm ready, I'm just going to come out. Because I got to a point, I don't know years earlier if I had been ready to come out. I just wanted to play like on the down low and just play baseball or try to work my way up. But finally, I got to a point in my life where I was like, "Okay, it's time to do this."

[00:11:36] And it's the same thing with the music. I started here in Nashville as a songwriter, writing songs for other artists. I've written over 40 songs that got recorded by different country and pop singers. But for me, it was like, okay, I need to be the artist now, not the songwriter. I need to be in front of the camera, in front of the microphone.

[00:11:58] Because they say, if you can see it, you can be it. And again, I just didn't grow up with a lot of people that I looked up to or was aware of in baseball or country music. Now it's a very fulfilling mission for me to both do my music and be in front of the microphone and be that person that I couldn't see as a kid. And the same thing in baseball with our charity.

[00:12:23] Kate: I want to get to all of this. I do have one question though, and it's a little heavy. Someone very close to me died by suicide because he would rather be dead than openly gay or bisexual. And it was so heartbreaking to learn this. And you know about this epidemic, not just suicide, but a lot of young people and kids are scared to be who they are for so many reasons.

[00:12:47] And my friend is no longer physically present, but what would you say to him, even on the other side, or people in that position that think the only choice is to end their life rather than be openly gay?

[00:13:01] Bryan: Yeah, there's definitely been times where I've been pretty down, pretty depressed, especially when I felt like I was so different than everybody in high school. I didn't really pinpoint it, but I just refused to accept it at the time. But I knew that I was different, and times where I've really struggled and felt like there was nobody that I could talk to.

[00:13:26] I know I get messages from people every day on social media who reach out to us or young players who reach out to our charity in baseball. Pretty much the thing that I say, it's a little cliche, but it does get better. It's just like, for me, everybody's circumstances are different.

[00:13:46] I've been lucky that I've been able to find people like me in the areas that I'm interested in and the things I like to do. But don't give up. Search for people like you. We all have one of these in our pocket. You can Google pretty much anything. You got to find your people.

[00:14:04] It does get better. If you're able to just take tiny little baby steps in the right direction forward to trying to find your people, pick your chosen family of people who support you. They say you are like the average of the five people you spend the most time around. I really believe that.

[00:14:24] Kate: Yeah. It really is the power of choice and your chosen family, your chosen relationships. And I'm just so proud of you and happy that you were in this loving relationship and you chose to stay alive and to be who you truly are and come out rather than thinking the only way out is death because of what mom and dad will think, or society will think, or the teammates will think.

[00:14:48] And so it's not to shame anybody else's decisions by any means. It's really just a testimony to the power of choice and choosing the truth. Can you talk a little bit about that, just owning your truth?

[00:15:01] Bryan: Yeah. Forever, I've felt this is how I am. I don't think it's a choice. I think it's just how I was made. I think that lots of LGBTQ+ people relate to that. And for me, I always try to frame it like, "As my job as a songwriter, it's all about how you frame it."

[00:15:26] That's what I've learned from my five years in Nashville, how you frame the story. And for my story, what I wanted to do was, hey, I am inviting you in to a part of me. If I am willing to be vulnerable with you, then you could be vulnerable with me, and we can have a deeper relationship.

[00:15:47] So that's the way that I prefaced it, was like, I'm inviting you into this part of me, and you can accept me or not, but if you don't accept me, then I'm not really going to pay you much attention. I'm living my life. You know what I mean?

[00:16:02] And I was a little hardheaded about that. But at the end of the day, it's a real, find-out-who-your-friends-are moment. There's a country song I love by Tracy Lawrence where it's a little cliche, but it's run your car off the side of the road, get stuck in a ditch way out in the middle of nowhere. Who's going to be there for you? Who's going to come? Those are your real friends. Who's going to show up?

[00:16:26] And coming out is a real find-out-who-your-friends-are moment. And for me, it's almost a blessing to be able-- straight people don't get that. They don't have a moment that's so clear cut where it's like, okay, who are my ride or dies in life?

[00:16:42] Let's get rid of all the fake people who are just around me because of whatever. Let's figure out who's really in my corner. So that's a blessing, I feel. And now that I know that, now that I know who's riding with me, we're off.

[00:17:00] Kate: Yeah. Let's let go of the fake friends. Amen. And I think anytime we change identities, go through a death and rebirth cycle, go through trauma, come out as we truly are, and we're no longer who we used to be, that identity-- in your case, Bryan, the heterosexual man-- you find out really fast.

[00:17:21] How are you able to let people go without feeling bad, or guilty, or maybe try to hang on, but you can tell they're only there because of your status and the world or something they think they might get from the relationship rather than what they can give?

[00:17:38] Bryan: That's a tough one. A lot of inner work. I've had to really solidify and gain confidence in who I am. I had very little confidence growing up, I think just feeling so different than everybody. But I think as you get older, I just have tried to surround myself with people who empower me, for who I am, be very intentional with that.

[00:18:06] I'm friendly with a lot of people, but I have a small, really core group of friends, and I think that if they love you, whether it's friends or family, anybody who truly loves you, I feel like will want you to be the best version of yourself that you can be. And for me, that version is living authentically, and out and proud. And I feel like the people who love me have accepted that-- not just accepted that, but embraced that.

[00:18:36] Kate: Yeah. What's gotten you through your darkest moment?

[00:18:39] Bryan: Music, by far. Always. I'm a music nerd in a jock's body.

[00:18:47] Kate: I love that. I love that. With the hair of a Greek God.

[00:18:55] Bryan: Well, so the hair was a baseball thing actually. The hair was like, I had a buzz cut my whole life, and I felt like I needed some good mojo to get some hits. I just wanted to grow a little bit out the back of my baseball cap, and I did, and I started to play better, and then all of a sudden I like, I'm very superstitious. I couldn't cut it off. So now here we are, and it's a little Jesusy, but we're going with it.

[00:19:21] Kate: I love that story. And even just a little tweak. And I ask because I've had dark moments, and I like to just talk about these things. And even there, you saw my change in energy, just something superstitious or a little tweak, running with that, and giving it a try. And then it becomes symbolic. And I know me. I'm a hair person too and got lots of it.

[00:19:41] It is my security blanket. When I worked in TV news, this man used to call me a talking hairdo, and I'm like, "I'm a talking hairdo." I love it. So you spoke about how music and hair, we'll throw the hair into, but how music really took you out of the darkness and into this beautiful place.

[00:20:02] And you have the God-given talent to write incredible songs and be an artist yourself. I'd love to talk about a new-ish song you have called Found & Lost. What was the inspiration behind this, and how do you take all this darkness and just literally transmute it into light, into love, into joy?

[00:20:21] Bryan: Yeah. So I would say the hair was more of a superstition. The music got me through. And that's been true my whole life. I have always been into music, even when I was really hardcore playing baseball. Not so much anymore, but music was my escape. Music was my thing. I could put the headphones in, and I could escape an environment that wasn't super welcoming to me at times.

[00:20:49] And I could curate my playlist, and I dove in to the stories in country music. I really related to country because of the storytelling. I almost thought of Nashville as this Disneyland type place of country music. They say three chords in the truth. It was a fantasy really of going there and being part of that community and just so different than baseball.

[00:21:17] But being in Nashville for five years now, I've really just dove into the songwriting. And my current project that I'm releasing right now, like you said, Found & Lost is a breakup record bringing it all the way back to the beginning about, I was in love for a bit there and came out in baseball.

[00:21:38] But we went our separate ways, and it wasn't quite done in-- let's say I was on the receiving end of the breakup. It wasn't quite done in the most thoughtful way as when somebody just leaves without really saying why. And so suddenly after four years together, it's really-- I don't mince words here.

[00:22:02] I had a lot of stuff to say in this record. And I feel like it's everybody who's send me messages about it so far came out not too long ago, but a lot of people have gone through similar things. And there's a song on there called If You Would've Told Me. The message is like, I would've been there for you if you would've told me you were struggling, if you would've told me some of these things.

[00:22:24] But when somebody doesn't really communicate and just leaves it, it leaves a lot of questions that are unanswered. And so for me, it was pretty clear that it was like I could reach out, but that was a dead-end road there. Again, I still haven't heard from my ex at all since the day that we separated, which was really, really, just shocking for me.

[00:22:51] I felt like it was going so well. And there's the songs on the record, there's a song called Return a Ring, where I thought what we had was the real thing. Now I got to return a ring. It's a whole storyline of like, when love leaves and all of a sudden the shock of that to if you would've told me. I read the five stages of grief book.

[00:23:13] Kate: Oh yeah.

[00:23:14] Bryan: Because it was a loss.

[00:23:16] Kate: Yes.

[00:23:18] Bryan: It was when the person you're closest with just disappears so suddenly. It's a loss. And there's a song in there called Come Back that I'm doing an acoustic version of, and it's by far the most meaningful song on the record for me at least. It's the moment when you realize, you know what? After what you did to me, if you're going to come back, I'm never going to talk to you again.

[00:23:44] And the tagline is very simple. Oftentimes I do like that whole Nashville songwriter thing, and we weave metaphors in there and clever wordplay, and this song was just straight up, like, if you want to come back, don't. That's the hook. And it's real. It's raw. And the day we wrote it, I felt like such a release.

[00:24:09] And then the final song on the record is called Lost on Me, where it's me asking what the heck happened. With some of these other songs, If You Would've Told Me and love Goes Without Saying goodbye, and finally Lost on Me, the line is my lover found another, so now I'm the one who's free.

[00:24:31] Kate: Ooh.

[00:24:31] Bryan: Right. So it's like the moment when you realize, okay, what happened? I found out what happened, but you know what, I'm moving on. This is my life, and it's your loss. At the end of the day, if you're somebody who has the capacity to do that, leaves somebody in the dust, I'm better off.

[00:24:51] No, I'm glad I found this out now. I'm better off. And you know what? I am living my life. I got so many good things going. We got a charity that's helping young LGBTQ kids who play baseball. I'm writing songs every day. I'm hitting the road. I got a band. We're playing gigs.

[00:25:09] We're making noise in country music, and I want to be somebody within the genre that I felt like I couldn't see as a kid, somebody who's making songs from the heart, living their life authentically, and just singing about what I care about. There's so much good stuff that's going on. We got to focus on that. And the EP is the journey. It gets us from start to finish there. We're nowhere near the finish line in what I want to do in music, but it's happening, and it's a whole storyline.

[00:25:43] Kate: It is so beautiful, and thank you so much for sharing all of that. You will find love again. I feel that with every inch of my body. I'm sorry for that heartache. It is so painful, and we've all been there. And if you haven't been there, your time's coming, so buckle up and listen to Bryan's music, and listen to this interview again and again, just for his insight and advice. What did you learn about yourself from this heartbreak and painful experience?

[00:26:15] Bryan: Yeah. Well, this is Rawish, right? So this is raw and real. Here we go. I learned that I can take care of myself. I learned that I was relying on someone for stuff and that I can do it. I found my independence again. I rediscovered the passions. I was pretty down in the dumps for a while afterwards, and now-- it takes a while for a record to get out. From the minute you write the song to get the money together, to record, have it produced and released, it's a whole cycle.

[00:26:51] So I am on the tail end of it in my real life right now. And what I've learned post breakup is just that it's an excuse, really, to dive in back into the things that I'm passionate about and really redirect the next part of my life. I thought I was going in one direction with that song, Return a Ring, and now I'm redirecting into my goals and into my life and investing my time in places where there's more potential.

[00:27:25] Kate: Ooh, yes.

[00:27:27] Bryan: I'm watering the seeds that I want to grow now. It's a transition coming off of breakup land, but I'm living my life for me, and that's an empowering thing once you can get to that mind space.

[00:27:44] Kate: Yeah. When I think of your story, I certainly think courage and authenticity. Thank you also for your vulnerability. But I can't help but-- ooh, I'm even gritting my teeth as I say it. The grit that you embody and the grit that it takes to be the professional baseball player and compete at that level to make it in country music and take all that on, to come out as openly gay and a homophobic sporting world and culture, and to keep gritting your teeth and just going through the heartache and keep showing up.

[00:28:15] And it's such a testament to your character. And I know, myself included, so many people listening who at times have wanted to throw in the towel, or they'd love to experience just a fraction of your success, or they want to start the business, whatever their thing is, whatever their craft or joy is.

[00:28:32] And I've had this moment too. I'm curious on your thoughts. You have these moments of, who cares? Why does it even matter? There's already a bunch of people doing this. Or I do this great post and the algorithm doesn't show it to anybody. Why bother? Why bother?

[00:28:48] Bryan: Yeah. Believe me, I get it. I spent so much time now-- as independent artists, we got to make a lot of videos for social media, and sometimes I will put my heart and soul into a song and a video, and I think, man, this is great. This is good songwriting. I spent so much time on this. It showcases my artistry. We're doing good stuff, and then nobody sees it.

[00:29:08] And then I'll accidentally make a dumb little video and then it'll blow up on socials. I try to detach from that as much as I can because it is so random with that, like you said, but motivation comes and goes. I am a human.

[00:29:33] I don't wake up motivated every day. None of us do. But for me, it's really about discipline. And the discipline comes from your goals. If you have a vision, the more clear you can get with your vision and the why that you're doing what you're doing, it makes it easier to find that motivation.

[00:29:56] For me, I know what I want to be in music. I knew what I wanted to be in sports. Now I know what I want to be in music, and it's about getting up every day and putting the work in and just doing something that can help. You don't have to be climbing Mt. Everest or solving world hunger every day.

[00:30:19] It's just the ability to just do something that helps, something that aligns with your goals. It could be just the tiniest little thing. Or if it's a day when you're really down and out-- we work super hard. We hit the road. We play a lot of gigs. I played over 100 gigs last year.

[00:30:37] If it's a day that I need for myself, just rest. But at the end of the day, that's helping me too because if I could get good rest, I know I'm going to wake up the next day with some energy, and then I can chase down my goals. The motivation comes and goes, but you got to remember the purpose of why you're doing whatever you're doing.

[00:30:59] Kate: You and I, we're so in alignment. That is why is this important to you and why right now. And your why will keep you going. Because if it is just to get the likes, get the views, get the money, get people to like you, validate your existence, it's going to be hard to sustain that.

[00:31:15] But for me, even in writing my book, for instance, my why was my two loved ones I lost to suicide. I dedicated the book to them. I wrote it for them, and everyone who struggles with mental health, which as I've discovered, especially during COVID, is all of us. And you have that strong why. All the people that look up to you, and you've been such an inspiration.

[00:31:32] You certainly inspire me. I appreciate anybody who's just daring to be who they truly are. And I say that also knowing that so many people have no idea who they are beneath the labels of baseball player, country music singer, friend, father, whatever. And so inviting people to take those steps into knowing who they truly are.

[00:31:53] Do you have any insight there on how people can get underneath the hood of the car to get rid of all the labels and embrace more of who they are? And how do you really even know who you truly are?

[00:32:06] Bryan: I think it's just a gut feeling. Whatever you feel in your gut, you have to be willing to explore that, whether that's sexuality-related or passions related with what you like to do day-to-day. There's always labels that are attached to us in what we do, in where we're from. But anything as simple as exploring your passions, taking time, really intentionally taking time to do the things that you're interested in.

[00:32:33] There's a lot of stuff that I'm interested in-- like you said, this is raw and real, so there's a lot of stuff that I'm interested in that the world doesn't see. I love certain kinds of books and movies. I love to dive into history stuff. I love old war movies.

[00:32:51] It's just a passion. It's, how do you figure out who you are? You figure out what you like to do. And maybe that doesn't like align with like, okay, I got to be a cool country music singer, but one day I'm going to write a kick ass song about-- I think of Jamie Johnson's song In Color.

[00:33:13] He's probably the same way with some of the verses of that song that ties in history. And it'll help me. Can't be afraid of what you're interested in at all. And I talk to a lot of younger athletes, a lot of younger musicians, showing up every day and chasing down what you're passionate about.

[00:33:36] Kate: Yeah. And even if it doesn't make you money at first-- and I want to go back to something you said earlier about rest, that's been a huge theme for me. And it seems counterproductive. It seems counterintuitive because it is. And it's really challenging to fight against programming that says you got to work 20 hours a day and you got to grind just to do anything or be anybody.

[00:33:56] And I find when I, ooh, shut all that noise off, whew, rest, and have that quiet time, that's when you get the downloads and the inspiration. It really is for me, and you're a musician, about fine tuning our instruments so that we can play it for the world with more sharpness and clarity. Or I guess you don't want to be sharp in music.

[00:34:15] See, I'm a non-musician. But more clarity and more-- so I can't state that enough. And it sounds funny coming from a professional athlete and a musician to say, no, rest is really going to be, a huge part of your success.

[00:34:31] Bryan: Yeah. And sports too, it really clicked when I had one trainer, Dave Lazer, back home, who showed me this video and explaining that we lift weights all day, but it's when we sleep that our body pumps the nutrients into our muscles to recover and build them up stronger so that when you go back to the gym the next day or the day after, you are stronger and more capable.

[00:34:59] So if you're taxing yourself too much where you can't rest and you can't decompress a little bit, that'll manifest itself long term. Now, as a singer, it's like being an athlete. I need to rest my voice. I need to train my voice. I need to do the warmups. You can't blow it out every night. Otherwise you're going to be in a tough position the next day. And I don't know. I just feel like the people who I gravitate towards, whether they're athletes or musicians, I try so hard to surround myself with people who are chasing their passions.

[00:35:37] Going back to the social media thing, before I was an artist myself, I was writing songs for a lot of different artists. Behind every artist that you hear on the radio, on Spotify, whatever streaming service you use is a whole crew of songwriters, the people that help them write their songs.

[00:35:56] And I was working with this one singer, and we had a song that I felt so good about. I felt like it was clever. I felt like it was a story that was relatable for people. I felt like the singer did a good job of really opening up and sharing the essence of what that song was.

[00:36:20] I was happy with it creatively, but the song went up and was released, and it did well, but not as well as the singer wanted. And I was hanging out one day backstage and that singer said to me, well, this song just isn't getting me famous enough.

[00:36:37] Kate: Ooh.

[00:36:38] Bryan: And I was like, "Whoa. Let's unpack that". Okay, so you're writing songs because you want to get famous? Because if you want to get famous, probably you shouldn't spend all these years grinding in music. You should probably just make a whole bunch of TikToks and try to jump on the trends and get famous or whatever your path to wanting to be famous is.

[00:37:02] It was just coming from such a different place. I felt like there's definitely some satisfaction in the songs if you're just trying to make music that you care about and that feeds your inner child and songs that you like. Every single song that I release, I love.

[00:37:18] I write so many songs. I've written hundreds of songs that the public will never hear. And people say that I'm on the path to figuring it out songwriting wise. We have different accolades, got named as a finalist for the John Lennon International Songwriting Prize last year.

[00:37:38] And what people don't realize is how many songs it took that I will never show people because they sucked to get the one good one. It's like baseball. You get a hit three out of 10 times, and you're in the Hall of fame. In music, it's a lot less. If you get one good song out of 100, you're in good shape, but you have to put the work in to write the other 99 so that you can develop the songwriting muscle and be in that space.

[00:38:08] And if you're doing it just because you want to get famous or for other reasons like that, I feel like it won't work out. And the singer that I was talking about is no longer in music. Still trying to get famous doing something else, which, go for it. Go for your dream. I don't want to crush anybody's dream.

[00:38:25] But for me, in tying this back to the heartbreak EP that I just released, it's my second EP. The first one was about growing up on the baseball field, which was a real life story for me, and coming out. And there's a song called Left Field. That's my most streamed song to date. And the chorus is, you got to be who you are.

[00:38:47] That was very much what I was going through when I was coming out in baseball. So that project, even though none of the songs were smash hits commercially, it still fed my inner soul and felt good for me to release. And same thing with this heartbreak EP. The mission really came from just trying to write some of these songs to help me get through this.

[00:39:13] And I'm a believer that if you do things and it comes from the right purpose, it'll connect to the right people, whether that's the baseball fans with the first songs or these songs connected to people who've gone through breakups. And I know a whole lot of people who've gone through breakups. So that's the mission.

[00:39:32] Kate: Thank you so much for all of that. I had 10 questions for you. I forgot half of them. But something that came up as you were talking, another country music artist, Shelby Lynne, I even use this story in my keynote, and I remember her winning best new artist at the Grammys a little over 20 years ago. I had never heard of her.

[00:39:52] But it's the only acceptance speech I've ever remembered besides when Kanye interrupted Taylor Swift at VMAs. She said, "Best new artist." She said, I am paraphrasing, "It's only taken me 13 years and seven albums to win best new artists," which I thought could only be for like your first album, best new artist. And she was a little snarky-- gracious, but snarky.

[00:40:17] And I thought, wow, to be recognized as best new artists 13 years and seven albums into the game where so many people like this man would've given up, or you think it's not hitting. And so you show that she was doing music for the passion of it. People are always looking for, what's my purpose? It's like, well, what are you passionate about?

[00:40:36] That's a huge clue, but thank you for that. And even in your journey and mission, because maybe you're not as well-known right now as Tim McGraw or Keith Urban, but your music is still so important, your message, and I think sometimes we focus more on, is my song going to impact 10 million people or 10 people?

[00:40:54] And that those 10 people, they're unworthy. Even myself, I've archived some posts. I'm like, oh, this post isn't performing well on social media, or I have to reinvent the wheel to get a lot of engagement on this post. But I'm like, "Were those 10 people not worthy of their lives being changed by what you posted?"

[00:41:14] So I think too, thank you for speaking also to some of the younger generations who want that instant gratification and it's really just not the name of the game. It's like you practicing once and becoming a professional baseball player. No, you were at the field every day for years. Literally.

[00:41:32] Bryan: Yeah. You have to plant seeds years before they ever come up. For me, in hearing about other singers who've been on similar paths, Chris Stapleton is someone I really look up to because he was a songwriter for other artists before he got his chance, just like me. Ed Sheeran. Ed Sheeran, I was reading, had seven EPs that were released before he blew up.

[00:41:59] Kate: I I didn't know that. And he's phenomenal. Have you seen him live?

[00:42:05] Bryan: No, it is on the bucket list.

[00:42:07] Kate: Oh, you got to go. I went by chance last summer after Taylor Swift. So I'm at the same stadium, SoFi in Los Angeles. I'm like, "Nothing's ever going to top this." But Ed Sheeran, I'm like, "Oh my gosh."

[00:42:19] Bryan: Yeah. And he's just somebody who again, is like, it's all about the songs. That's what it comes down to for me. Jelly Roll, another one. His acceptance speech that he gave recently at, I don't know how old he is-- 38, 39-year-old man who just won best new artists. He's released a whole bunch of stuff as well. And he was in prison for a while. You never know when it's going to hit. I feel like it meant to hit whenever it's meant to hit. And you just got to keep following your passion.

[00:42:52] Kate: Sorry to interrupt you, but don't you think it hits when we're not trying to make it a hit? Even Billie Eilish said something after she won the Grammy for that song she had in the movie Barbie. And someone's asking her about winning the Grammy. And she's so young. She said, "Literally, the last thing I was ever thinking when I sat down to write this song is, ooh, we got to write a song that's going to win a Grammy."

[00:43:16] And I think that's case in point. If you try to sit down like you and I right now-- we got to write a song that's going to win a Grammy. But if we just sit down in the joy of it, or I even say, so write me a song about this heartache and really get in there and tell me what it did to your heart, and get raw. I'm not saying it's going to win a Grammy, but it's going to be a lot more impactful than us writing some contrived song that we think people want to hear or we think is going to be successful.

[00:43:43] Bryan: Yeah, it's a journey. Songwriting for me is all about, you just got to say what's on your mind. I get a lot of my ideas in the most random of places. Could be in the shower. I could be driving in my truck, and then I'll get something. And half of my voice notes on my phone and or my notes app are just mumbo jumbo me, mumble it into the phone.

[00:44:05] And then when I have a minute to actually sit down and look through it, then I'll try to dig in and see if it's a good idea or not. But you just got to write what's true to you. I think that's the name of the game songwriting wise, if you're doing it. And not every song is meant to be a hit. Some songs I write just for me. Some songs I write and share with my family and friends. And some songs I write and I share with the world.

[00:44:31] It's like anything else. You just got to give it a go. And for me it's been almost five years in Nashville writing songs every day, playing the bars, hustling, trying to grind our way up. And for me it's, there's no timeline on it. It takes however long it takes.

[00:44:51] There's no backup plan. I feel like every singer I've known who's had a backup plan has taken the backup plan. As the going gets tough, there's times when we're hot, and there's times when we're not. But I know one guy who wanted to do some tech thing and went back to get his degree so he could do IT.

[00:45:15] And I know another guy who moved back home, and it's just like, for me, there's no backup plan. I'm staying here in Nashville forever. Takes however long it takes. We're going to make it work. We don't know how, but we're going to do it. And that's the--

[00:45:30] Kate: I believe you.

[00:45:30] Bryan: Philosophy. And that's the--

[00:45:31] Kate: I believe in you, I believe you, and I love that philosophy. One thing that's coming to mind is underneath all of these desires and feelings of wanting to be successful, financially free, impact a lot of people, " be famous", blow up as that gentleman said, or go viral, I think underneath that, something that's come to mind for me recently is we really just want to feel safe.

[00:45:55] We want to feel safe financially. We want to feel safe in our identity, whatever that is. We want to feel safe in our desires. We want to feel safe in our truth and in our bodies. Do you have any insight on how we can do that, just feel more safe overall? Because what you've done in many instances has been unsafe, and you've chosen to do it anyway. And it sounds like in doing that, you do feel a sense of safety because you are free.

[00:46:24] Bryan: Yeah. For me, safety is all about figuring out who you can rely on. For years, I played baseball at the lower levels of the pro ranks, which I would do things like flying to South America to go do a tryout, taking the bus down the coast of South America with my baseball bag and a backpack. And that's not really that safe of an environment.

[00:46:51] Or flying on my own dime to go try out somewhere if I didn't have a spot. Or moving to Nashville with money for first month's rent and everything I owned in the back of my truck, knowing no one. And finding a place on Facebook marketplace, finding a guy who was renting out a room in his house. Four or five guys lived there, and he would rent out the rooms. I had an old futon from my mom's basement in the back of the truck, and that's what I slept on for my first year in Nashville.

[00:47:23] I learned through all of that that I can rely on myself. If I'm taking the bus down the coast of Chile in South America, I got to figure out what I need. I need the essentials. I need figure out where I'm getting food next day. I need to figure out where I'm staying.

[00:47:40] I need to figure out how I'm getting home. I needed a local sim card so I could use my phone. So I had to go figure out how to get that. It's just figuring out one thing at a time, and safety is also about figuring out who you can rely on. Who's in your corner? Like I said, I don't have the giant group of friends, but I know the people I got are solid people.

[00:48:01] If I make that call, I can rely on them. Or if I text them, I need something, and if they need me, I'm going to be there for them too. So it is just about building up your network of people with shared passions, common purpose, and people you can rely on.

[00:48:19] Kate: Yeah. And you've created that safety for others, your charity, Proud To Be In Baseball, building community, and helping others truly embrace their identities and their truth. Can you tell us about that and how it relates to the legacy you want to leave behind?

[00:48:34] Bryan: Yeah, I created our charity, Proud To Be In Baseball, to just be the megaphone whose sole purpose is to show that LGBTQ+ people can be in baseball. So even though I'm a country singer now, and I'm not actively playing anymore, we still do a ton of events around the sport and are trying to do as much as we possibly can to show that next generation that it's possible.

[00:49:01] We do all kinds of stuff. We're based here in Nashville. We're a member of the Tennessee Pride Chamber of Commerce, and we've done a lot of local events here as well as hit the road, especially during Pride Month, because that's when pretty much every major league baseball team has their Pride night. And we try to just get as many people involved as we can.

[00:49:23] We try to drum up public interest for increasing LGBTQ representation in the sport. We advocate, educate, and try to create opportunities for the next generation of players. So we do stuff like going to the American Baseball Coaches Association convention. We have our booth, and we speak in front of 8,000 baseball coaches who are there.

[00:49:51] We connect with players, and we try to connect players with each other, and it's like a giant volunteer effort, but it is something that I'm truly passionate about and something that-- look, we haven't raised a ton of money. I've tried to come up with creative ways, like my song Left Field where the chorus has, "Got to be who you are." We donated 100% of the proceeds from that song to the charity.

[00:50:14] And so we try to drum up ways. I do fundraiser concerts. I try to raise as much money as I can, and the whole mission is just to be the thing that I never had as a kid. I wish I could have had the thing that could have helped me the most, something where I could see other people like me. They say, if you could see it, you can be it. Something that I felt like could help plant the seeds of making the sport just a little bit more comfortable and accepting for the next crop of players that are coming up.

[00:50:54] Kate: I love that. Thank you so much. And we'll certainly put all of this information in the show notes and send people your way because I'm sure a lot of people are going to want to be involved and support you and your mission. So thank you for that. I know you're quite young, and I'll let you go soon, but I'm just curious to ask, when you look back at your life thus far, what are you most proud of?

[00:51:16] Bryan: I'm most proud of-- this is a tough one-- where I started and where I am now. I'm proud that I was able to work my way through coming out while playing baseball, to set up the charity that helps younger people like me, and now to be in music and have that be the focus of most of what I'm doing, singing the songs I wish I could have heard somebody like me singing when I was a kid.

[00:51:45] So just singing songs about real life that anybody can relate to in country music, no matter who you are or where you're from. And that's just what I'm going to keep doing, and hopefully we're having a different conversation in five, 10 years down the line and I'm getting ready to play the football stadium, or wherever, or go on Good Morning America or whatever the thing is in five years. But it's about having that purpose and knowing your why and going out every day and getting it.

[00:52:18] Kate: From my lips to God's ears, I will be that person at SoFi Stadium interviewing you backstage, and we'll remember this moment and say, "Hey, we got here because we were true to our passion, our purpose, and the work, and we honored the journey and respected the journey." My lips to God's ears.

[00:52:38] I'm excited for us and everything you're doing. I just feel called to add this on our way out here. I really have to give you so much credit for the work that you've done, and this has been such an extraordinary conversation for me. I am so empathetic when I am talking to someone and they have a lot of either unhealed stuff or they're saying all the right things, but they don't feel confident to express who they truly are, and they aren't really speaking their full truth. It's more of their representative is the spokesperson rather than them.

[00:53:12] I find myself getting emotional in interviews or in conversations because I feel, this is even my intuition speaking, that I'm feeling the feelings that they aren't able to feel. I'm feeling their feelings that they don't feel safe to feel. And while I've been so touched by this conversation, I don't feel those emotions coming up in me, which tells me you have done the work, my friend, because there is safety there, truth, and authenticity.

[00:53:40] So thank you. Because so many times I'm crying and I'm like, these aren't even my tears or what's happening. But so few people-- and I say this with love and no, no judgment. It's challenging as you know, but so few people are able to show up, especially in a public interview and not send the representative-- to send themselves. So thank you for that because you're going to give people that safety and that freedom to do it too, and you're such a template and role model for how to do it. So thank you so much.

[00:54:11] Bryan: Thank you. Thank you for doing this. This is raw and real. I get a lot of interview requests, and I have become a little more picky and choosy about what I'm doing, but this was a mission that I could get behind. So I really appreciate what you're doing, and I'm excited to listen to the other episodes when they come out.

[00:54:30] Kate: Yeah. Thank you so much. We'll have to do it again, and I'll see you in a few years at your big stadium tour, and my show will be on the road too.

[00:54:37] Bryan: All right. Deal.

[00:54:39] Kate: I'm so excited. Bryan Ruby, thank you so much. You're such an inspiration. And thank you for watching. We appreciate you being here. We'll see you next time right back here on Rawish with Kate Eckman. Bye, everybody.